Edie Hirsch Rubin is the eldest of two children of Miriam Braun and Sigmund Hirsch, Romanians who fled Europe in early 1939. Edie describes her parents’ emigration by ship to Palestine, where they joined her mother’s cousin in Kibbutz Dan in the Golan. A couple of years later, they moved to Haifa and, in 1941, Edie was born; her sister, Ronite, was born in 1945. Edie talks about conditions in Haifa while growing up. Housing and food were scarce, tensions ran high, and they often sought refuge in bomb shelters during nighttime shelling of the city. She recalls feeling sad and acutely aware, as a child, of having almost no extended family. Her father had encouraged family members to leave Europe, to no avail, and most were killed in the Holocaust. Edie’s sadness was compounded by her lack of knowledge about the relatives who were lost; her parents did not share their memories with her or her sister. In 1952, the Hirsches moved to Montreal, Quebec, Canada. Edie discusses the move and how the family adjusted to a new country. She met her husband, Joseph Rubin, in Montreal, and they married in 1961. Joseph’s profession as a cardiothoracic surgeon brought the Rubins to the United States. They raised their four children in Augusta, Georgia, and retired in Charleston, South Carolina. Edie worked in special education. She has always tried to live her life the way her father taught her—give back to the community and be grateful for what you have. This is one of a number of interviews conducted by Ph.D. candidate Lucas Wilson for his dissertation, “The Structures of Postmemory: Portraits of Survivor-Family Homes in Second-Generation Holocaust Literature.” Wilson was awarded two Charleston Research Fellowships (May 2017, February 2019) by the Pearlstine/Lipov Center for Southern Jewish Culture at the College of Charleston.
Blanche Weintraub Wine and her daughter Dana Wine Johnson discuss how the experiences of Blanche's parents as Holocaust survivors have shaped their lives. Blanche, the oldest of six children, explains how Guta Blas and Leon Weintraub met in Wierzbnik, Poland, where they were incarcerated during World War II, and how they reconnected after liberation and ended up in Charleston, South Carolina. Central to Guta and Leon's story is sixteen-year-old Guta's brazen attack on a German officer just as she and other Jews, including her mother, were about to be shot. The force of Guta's personality is a recurring theme throughout the interview. Blanche recalls her mother telling her she was a replacement for her grandmothers, which she says didn't feel like that much of a burden, "but certainly, I knew there were certain things expected of me." She adds, "I was obligated to be the best I could be because . . . I was the product of two special people." Blanche describes how her parents introduced their memories to her as a young girl in an "age-appropriate" manner, providing greater detail as she got older. She became more emotional about her parents' experiences as an adult, when she was old enough to understand the "depth of suffering." Blanche acknowledges she had difficulty fitting in with Charleston's Jewish community and was lonely at times. She was aware that the other Jewish children were surrounded by extended family, something the Weintraubs were lacking. Dana says her experience is similar to her mother's in that she heard about the Holocaust from a young age and her sensitivity to it increased as she got older. She tells her grandmother's story whenever she is given the opportunity. She believes it's important to keep sharing stories so that the lessons of the Holocaust are not forgotten as the number of survivors diminishes. Blanche considers her negative feelings toward Poland and the Polish people, while Dana eagerly outlines her plan to visit Poland and retrace her grandparents' steps. This is one of a number of interviews conducted by Ph.D. candidate Lucas Wilson for his dissertation, "The Structures of Postmemory: Portraits of Survivor-Family Homes in Second-Generation Holocaust Literature." Wilson was awarded two Charleston Research Fellowships (May 2017, February 2019) by the Pearlstine/Lipov Center for Southern Jewish Culture at the College of Charleston.
David Moise Rosenberg is joined by his mother, Anita Moise Rosefield Rosenberg, in this interview, recorded in his place of business, West Side Deli, in Charleston, South Carolina. Keeping kosher is the focus of the conversation, a practice that was not observed in the family home when David was growing up in the 1960s and '70s. The Rosenbergs were members of Kahal Kadosh Beth Elohim (KKBE) in Charleston, which David describes as a "very liberal Reform temple." During his college years, he "had no interest in religion of any sort." His wife, Marcie, who grew up in a Conservative synagogue and wanted to keep kosher, sparked his interest in Judaism. David, a restaurateur, and Marcie, a chef, bought Alex and Lila Lash's kosher meat business and, in January 1992, opened West Side Deli, a market, restaurant, and delicatessen. David talks about their clientele?who they are, and who, among Charleston's Orthodox, Conservative, and Reform Jews, are keeping kosher. David explains why he and Marcie think it's important to keep a kosher home, a process that was gradual for them, and he responds to the question, "how [do] you fit being observant in with being religious?" Anita, who grew up in Sumter, South Carolina, in the 1940s and '50s, and received a Classical Reform education at Temple Sinai, notes that she knew "absolutely nothing" about keeping kosher as a child. Her mother's ancestors can be traced in America to the 1700s; the family had been in Sumter for generations and were fully adapted to local foodways. When she was growing up, Anita's family "ate everything." Yet she describes a "very strong Jewish upbringing" and her deep involvement with KKBE, the Jewish Community Center, and other Jewish organizations. She does not keep kosher, but says, "I don't eat anything that walked on four legs." Anita discusses the family history of her husband, Ira Rosenberg, and his preferences in regard to kashrut. She sees that Reform Jews, nationwide, are becoming more traditional. "I think, probably, if Reform had been at the particular stage that it is now, in terms of the traditional trappings, the Conservative Movement would have had a hard time getting a foothold." She and Ira would have loved to settle in Sumter but decided to raise their children in Charleston, where their children "would have a much better chance of being Jewish and having a Jewish social life and marrying Jewish and continuing what was very important to us." For 2019 interviews with Anita, see Mss. 1035-554 and Mss. 1035-555. For Anita's 2016 interviews with her husband, Ira Rosenberg, see Mss. 1035-452 and Mss. 1035-461. For a 1995 interview with Anita's mother, Virginia Moise Rosefield, see Mss. 1035-007.
Richard Weintraub was born in Charleston, South Carolina, the fourth of six children, to Guta Blas and Leon Weintraub, both Holocaust survivors. He relates some details of his parents’ story, in particular Guta’s daring attack on a German officer after being told she and a group of people that included her mother were about to be shot. Richard doesn’t recall his father ever talking about his wartime experiences. Guta, however, “could talk about it anytime, anywhere, to anybody.” Richard believes it was cathartic for her, but says “I’m convinced she never really got it out of her system.” He considers his response, as a child, to hearing his mother’s stories, noting he “never felt any residual effect of their experiences.” Richard describes his childhood as normal and thinks Guta was overprotective of him, more so than his siblings. He explains why he think it’s important to contribute to Holocaust awareness and to speak out against injustice. This is one of a number of interviews conducted by Ph.D. candidate Lucas Wilson for his dissertation, “The Structures of Postmemory: Portraits of Survivor-Family Homes in Second-Generation Holocaust Literature.” Wilson was awarded two Charleston Research Fellowships (May 2017, February 2019) by the Pearlstine/Lipov Center for Southern Jewish Culture at the College of Charleston.
William Lindsay Koob III (b. 1946) is a Citadel graduate (1968) who served fourteen years in US Army intelligence, rising to the rank of Major. While stationed at the Pentagon in 1987, he admitted under interrogation to being gay and was forced to resign his commission. A short time later, he came out to his parents and brother: “I told the whole story, and by that time I was in tears. My brother said a few things, and basically,everyone sat and waited for my father to respond--the retired army colonel. Here I was, the third generation of my family to serve in the military. But, my dad just kind of sat there, looking down at the table. After a while, he just got up from the table, and he walked around, and he pulled me to my feet and said, ‘Son, I don't like it, I don't understand it. I’m going to have to think about this for a long time, but you're my son and I love you.’ Could I have asked for anything more? No.” Koob further reported that his Citadel classmates, following the leadership of their company commander, have been accepting of his homosexuality: “I am still one of the brotherhood. And, for that, I will be eternally grateful.” Koob, who resides in Ladson, South Carolina, is an accomplished classical music critic and journalist.
Bobby Richardson was born in Sumter, South Carolina on August 19, 1935. While playing high school and American Legion baseball, he was discovered by the New York Yankees and after his high school graduation he joined them. He played two years on the Yankees' minor league farm team and at nineteen he participated in his first professional game. Richardson played with the Yankees for ten years from 1955 to 1966 and won nine out of ten World Series. Richardson earned several awards and holds still-standing records. Following his retirement from professional baseball Richardson coached the University of South Carolina Gamecocks from 1970-1976. In the interview Richardson recalls his friendships with baseball legends Mickey Mantle and Roger Maris; he shares his opinions about the present-day game of baseball, including length of the season, finances, and steroid use. Finally he reflects about the importance of his faith and the impact it has on his personal and professional life. When asked about his best year in baseball he choose 1962, stating "It was just one of those years when everything seemed to go my way."
Radio host and producer Osei Terry Chandler was born in Brooklyn, New York in 1946. His father was a musician and his mother loved listening to music. Growing up in his multicultural city, he was exposed to all kinds of music. As a teenager, he joined his high school radio and mixed music at parties. He moved to Jacksonville, Illinois to attend MacMurray College and there continued DJing and working for the college radio. After graduation, he returned to New York to support his younger brothers and there he met and fell in love with Sadeeka Joyner, a young woman from Ridgeville SC, who would become his wife and the mother of his three children. In 1977, Chandler relocated to Charleston. Soon after, he found an opportunity to work on a jazz radio program replacing the host Tony Robertson. Later he focused mostly on reggae and Caribbean music. His program Roots Musik Karamu has been on the air in SC Public Radio since 1979. In the interview, Chandler recalls some of the most memorable moments of his career and reflects about the evolution of the music scene in Charleston. Finally, he states he has had a joyful life sharing his work with musicians and friends and explains that all the aspects of his life, family, his work as an educator and the music, are tied together. Mostly he always has wanted to share music that brings positive feelings and thoughts that are uplifting for the community.
Galen Hudson, owner of Monster Music and Movies Store, was born in Richmond, Virginia in 1967 and he grew up in Chapel Hill, North Carolina. His earliest musical memories relate to his love for bagpipes and drums and the music of his Catholic grade school. He remembers the first record he bought- Steve Miller Band, Fly Like an Eagle when he was just a nine-year-old kid. He got his first job in a books and records store when he was a teenager. After graduating from college with a Bachelor in Psychology, he went to work for a retail music and entertainment store chain, Record Bar, in Chapel Hill. Later, he moved with his girlfriend to Charleston where he continued working with record stores, first at Manifest Discs and Tapes and later at Cats Music. In the interview, Hudson talks about the negative impact that the big boxes commercial model and the early file-sharing services had on the records business. However, he argues small local stores are resilient and have learned to adjust. He talks about Record Store Day, an initiative started by of a coalition of independent record stores fifteen years ago. He states his store and the Record Store Day are successful thanks to the Charleston community's cultural vibrancy and support.
Musician and art entrepreneur Leah Suárez was born on August 12, 1981, in Greenwood South Carolina. She grew up in Charleston with her parents and three brothers and her childhood activities revolved around soccer and music. As early musical experiences, she remembers singing with her mother the mixed tapes her brother created for her. Suárez formal musical training started in middle school when she joined the school band and learned to play the euphonium. She received a scholarship to study the instrument at George Mason University College but she dropped out due to health problems. She returned to South Carolina and enrolled at the College of Charleston where she focused on vocals. At the age of twenty-four, she participated in the Copenhagen Jazz Festival and lived in Europe for six months. Back in Charleston, with the support of her mentor and friend, Jack McCray co-founded Jazz Artists of Charleston (JAC) becoming the organization Executive Director and the co-producer the Charleston Jazz Orchestra. In the interview, Suárez explains that her life experiences and the issues affecting her community shaped her voice and art. She reflects about the challenges and rewards of being a musician entrepreneur in Charleston, her work with other Charleston musicians, and the importance of re-connecting with her Latino roots.
Songwriter, singer, and guitarist Eddie Bush was born in Princeton, a small rural town in Indiana, in 1965 and he has lived in the Lowcountry since the early 70s. When he was four years old, his father taught him basic guitar chords and since then he never stopped learning and perfecting his craft. In the interview, Bush talks about the musicians that influenced him, remembers his teen years playing in Charleston and reflects about the evolution of Charleston music scene. Bush recalls some of the most memorable moments of his career such as touring with Eric Johnson, becoming a member of the harmony group One Flew South, standing on a stage by John Mellencamp and Willie Nelson, designing his own guitar and the overwhelming public response he received for his songs "Spirit of America" and "The Thin Blue Line." Finally, he discusses the challenges of making a living as a musician in the time of the internet and takes pride in his work as a guitar teacher. Teaching gives him the opportunity to nurture young talents and share his values as a musician.
Vocalist Aisha Kenyetta (a.k.a Aisha Frazier) was born in 1980, in Monetta, South Carolina. Before going to college, her life revolved around family and church activities. Kenyetta describes herself as a freelance vocalist with a powerful voice: "I'm a power singer... but when I sing, my diction is rhythmic. My voice is an extension of the percussion instruments. It's not—I'm not the violin. I'm the bass." She performs with her own band AmpSquared and several other such as Super Deluxe, Plane Jane, and the musician collective Emerald Empire. Additionally, she is the North Charleston Seacoast Church's Worship Leader. In the interview, Kenyetta discusses balancing family, day work, and music career and states she is grateful for the many opportunities to perform. At the time of the interview, Kenyetta was writing her own material.
Saxophonist Abe White was born in downtown Charleston in 1935. He attended Burke High and there he realized he could be a musician. Soon, with almost no training, he started playing at the local bars in Reynolds Avenue in North Charleston and in downtown Charleston. The job allowed him to make money and support his mother financially but also exposed him to the nightlife dangers. After graduating from high school, White joined the Air Force in administrative positions. He was stationed in Texas, Colorado, California, Florida, Germany, and Thailand. On each place, after his office hours, he pursued opportunities to play. When he returned to the civil life, he started his own business, "The Abe White Affair". In the interview, White reflects about his music and career and the long journey that took him from playing at armors and bars to his performances in local concerts and the Piccolo Spoleto Festival.
Anne Marie Gilliard (b. 1928) was born in Mt. Pleasant, South Carolina; her father was a farmer and her mother a seamstress and washerwoman. Gilliard attended school until fourth grade and soon after started working with her mother mending and ironing clothes. In the interview, she remembers going with her sick sister to the Cannon Hospital in downtown Charleston: the trip would take all day; the building was old and dilapidated, but the nurses were kind and professional. Gilliard reflects about the penuries of living in Charleston and negotiating the relationships with white residents but also with upper-class blacks. She states, people from the rural areas distrusted both, white and black doctors and the medications they prescribed. Gilliard recalls she was a teenager when she discovered the places for dancing and drinking. She met a musician from Chicago and started singing in clubs, but when she got pregnant, he abandoned her. Later she got married to another man and had another son. The family relocated on Awendaw and she rarely made it back to Charleston.
The Mayor of Charleston discusses the Making Cities Livable International Conference in Charleston in February 2000. He emphasizes the importance of farmers and farmers' markets in Charleston. Riley explains the implementation of an urban growth boundary on John?s Island, which prevents any urban or suburban type developments beyond the boundary. Riley suggests that the urban growth boundary protects farmers from the infringement of developers.
David Cosgrove?s parents both came to America in 1964 and met in Elizabeth, New Jersey. David's parents are from rural areas in County Galway and County Mayo. Davd's father lived in Ireland until he was twenty two years old, when he moved to London with his brother, and David's mother came to America straight from Ireland at the age of nineteen. He has been to Ireland several times, as his parents regularly took him and his four brothers over to their hometowns during his childhood. David takes care to discuss similarities and differences between life and politics in Ireland and Charleston.
Cheryl Daniels was born in Jersey City, New Jersey. Both of Cheryl?s parents were also born in Jersey City and their parents immigrated from Galway and Cork. Cheryl?s grandparents initially immigrated to America for better job opportunities. She discusses their journey to Americanize themselves upon entering the country by changing their names. She discusses the influence of Catholicism on her family and her public school education experience in America. Cheryl has lived in New Jersey, Colorado, and South Carolina.
Jeanne Chirdon discusses her experience with Irish heritage and the journey of her family?s immigration from Ireland. After her great great grandparents immigrated from Ireland, they settled in Pennsylvania. Some of her family traveled through the port in Cork, Ireland and most of her family immigrated through Ellis Island, New York. One of seven siblings, Jeanne grew up Roman Catholic and discusses Catholic traditions and how they have influenced her life. Jeanne shares the role of Irish music in her life, which developed from her relationship with "the Toms" at the age of 16. Music, for Jeanne, influenced her sense of community and comfort in Irish culture. After living in Cork, Ireland from 2003-2006, Jeanne moved to Asheville for graduate school, and later moved to Charleston with her husband. She plays the banjo, and is very involved in the Irish music scene in Charleston.
United Methodist Church minister James Ellis Griffeth (b. 1942) grew up in Greenville, S.C. He attended Wofford College and later Duke Divinity School in Durham, NC. He worked as a chaplain with the Greenville Health System for twenty-four years until his retirement in 1998. In the interview, Griffeth discusses his association with South Carolina Clergy Consultation Service for Problem Pregnancies (SCCCS) in Greenville. He explains why he became involved and details the problems women requiring counsel faced during that time in South Carolina. Finally, he reflects on his own spiritual beliefs regarding abortion.
Interview with Bill and Suzanne McIntosh, long-time owners of 66 Anson Street (Chazal House), who reminisce about their home and the changes in the Ansonborough neighborhood that they have witnessed over the past 50+ plus years. Mr. McIntosh was a long-time Charlestonian who descended from Mary Fisher Bailey Cross, a Quaker, who came to Charleston in 1680. He grew up on Greenhill Street and later lived on New and Broad Streets. He went to the Craft School and High School of Charleston. He owned a successful travel agency on Broad Street and was the president of the Preservation Society during the "Omni [now Charleston Place] controversies." Mrs. McIntosh is from New Orleans where they met when both were in college. Mrs. McIntosh worked for the Evening Post. They purchased 66 Anson Street from Historic Charleston Foundation in 1961 through its Ansonborough Rehabilitation Project. They bought the house because as preservationists they wanted to restore a house. Also the house was inexpensive and they wanted a house with a yard. They had followed the lead of Peter Manigualt (Evening Post Industries) who had previously purchased a house in Ansonborough. Within eight years after they bought the house, at least 8 other Evening Post/News & Courier staff bought homes in Ansonborough, and as word spread, many others got excited and moved there. Repairing, restoring, and renovating the house has been an ongoing process, starting when the McIntoshes cleared out sand on the ground that had reached the front steps, added a new roof, and installed electricity and plumbing. Herbert DeCosta did the work and also advised on the interiors. Through the Ansonborough Rehabilitation Project under Frances Edmunds's leadership, Ansonborough became one of the most desirable neighborhoods in Charleston. Regarding neighborhood conditions and changes, like other homes in Ansonborough, 66 Anson Street was in deteriorated and neglected condition when the McIntoshes bought it. Many people thought the area was a dangerous slum but "many didn't see the neighborhood for how good it was … It was a poor community, not a slum … After World War II there wasn't any money" so the homes slowly became run down and weren't repaired. There had been corner grocery stores which were essential as most residents didn't have cars. (The corner stores were converted to residential during the Ansonborough Rehabilitation Project.) Many new Ansonborough homeowners were young couples before they had children. They socialized and shared information, eventually forming the Ansonborough Neighborhood Association. Ansonborough was a close community but has changed significantly over the years. Mr. and Mrs. McIntosh are the only original ARP homeowners living in the borough and they don't know many of their neighbors. Tourism has had an impact on Ansonborough, largely that of the carriage tours which Mr. and Mrs. McIntosh have not liked since the earliest tours. The rising value of homes has made it more expensive to live and maintain a house; almost all of the McIntosh's former neighbors have moved. There are also many part-time residents, which has changed the character of the neighborhood. Interviewed by Katherine Pemberton on April 21, 2016 at the McIntosh's home at 66 Anson Street.
Interview by Valerie Perry of Arthur Lawrence who lives in Charleston's West Side. Mr. Lawrence reminisces about growing up on the West Side when it was primarily an African-American community. He recalls day-to-day life in the West Side, referring to businesses, grocery and corner stores, restaurants, movie theaters, and hotels/boarding houses. He also talks about the changes to both Charleston and the West Side community and reflects on gentrification, segregation, integration, housing, and heirs' rights, about the roles of hotels for African-American visitors during segregation. Mr. Lawrence, who was president of the neighborhood association for 20 years, worked with Mayor Riley and the Chief of Police on efforts to improve the community. He discusses the efforts and its successes. He also touches upon the importance of the church in the community. Grants from both the South Carolina Humanities Commission and the Employees Community Fund of Boeing allowed HCF to proceed with this initiative and several oral history interviews have been conducted that focus on specific neighborhoods and the changes these residents have experienced over time.
Interview by April Wood of Gladys G. Harvey, a woman who grew up in the North Central neighborhood. Her father was carpenter and also a pastor of Gethsemane Church and her son is the current pastor of the church. Ms. Harvey describes her experience growing up as a pastor's daughter and how her father was very protective of her and her siblings. She recalls shopping for clothes and also the neighborhood grocery stores. She also discusses the Charleston Hospital Workers strike and how she felt when Martin Luther King was killed, and about her having gotten pregnant at 16 and had to leave Burke High School for a private school in Denmark, SC. She reminisces about lunches after church on Sundays and how this was the biggest event of the week. There was a lot of cross over between Gethsemane Baptist Church and New Israel Reformed Episcopal Church as neighbors, especially after Sunday services. Ms. Harvey has had the opportunity to travel a lot in more recent years and has enjoyed this opportunity. Grants from both the South Carolina Humanities Commission and the Employees Community Fund of Boeing allowed HCF to proceed with this initiative and several oral history interviews have been conducted that focus on specific neighborhoods and the changes these residents have experienced over time.
Interview by April Wood of Erica and Dan Lesesne who purchased their home on Warren Street in 1989 from Historic Charleston Foundation through its Home Ownership Program (revolving fund). They are now some of the longest-term residents in the neighborhood in Radciffborough. The Lesesnes talk about the changes they have observed in the neighborhood including the demographics. For example, there had been many more older families who lived in there but they have moved out, and also are fewer African-American families than there used to be. They also describe the neighborhood as eclectic, which appealed to them. They discuss their experience purchasing the house from HCF and how they appreciate that it is protected by a covenant. They reminisce about Charleston architect Randolph Martz and also about Robert Ballard, who was the president of the neighborhood association and very involved in civic affairs. The Lesesnes also discuss their backgrounds. Mrs. Lesesne was an English teacher at Porter Gaud and an acting teacher. They also talk about spearheading an effort to preserve the family cemetery on Daniel Island. Grants from both the South Carolina Humanities Commission and the Employees Community Fund of Boeing allowed HCF to proceed with this initiative and several oral history interviews have been conducted that focus on specific neighborhoods and the changes these residents have experienced over time.
Vivian Cleary, 64, was born in Dublin, Ireland. He shares stories about life in the Northside of Dublin. Vivian lived in Dublin until he was three years old when his parents moved to Birmingham, England, where he lived until the age of 17. Vivian shares experiences of family holidays in Ireland. Vivian came to Charleston twenty years ago and discusses how different life is in America. He discusses political issues with America during this time along with the process for applying for permanent residency. Vivian is also able to shed light on historical events in Ireland, such as experiences with the IRA, and separation of Northern Ireland and the Republic.
Sunshine Goodman (pronouns: She/Her/Hers) discusses life experiences, spirituality, work in the beauty industry, her philosophy and attitude to life and her assumption of the role as a “self-proclaimed ambassador of authenticity.” Growing up in Roanoke, VA, Goodman spent time as a youth with her mother’s family in Charleston, SC. Bullied in school for appearing feminine and steered away from coming out in a small conservative town, Goodman left after high school to live with an aunt in Charleston. First working in women’s fashion stores, Goodman then became an apprentice with a stylist to gain a barber’s license. While pursuing a strong sense of personal style and founding a brand called Celebritimage, Goodman also searched for the most authentic way of living and manifesting a God-given individuality. While getting both positive and negative feedback for the change she made in her appearance, Goodman refused to be defined by an image, instead feeling that “everything I do...is for the benefit of other people. Even the way I look is not just for me.” Goodman discusses her feelings about God’s watching out for all, her experiences with angels, numerology, and prophetic voices telling her truths about others and herself. It is a gift she uses to help others find confidence, their true calling, and to embrace their bodies and sexuality, also the theme of her book Three Seasons of Life: Discovery, Believe, Faith. Living briefly in Los Angeles, Goodman speaks of being gender fluid and identifying with the trans community, saying that all are capable of transformation. In response to questions, she addresses homophobia within the African American and African American religious communities, prejudice within the LGBTQ community, and she describes many Charleston bars such as Dudley’s, Pantheon, the Cure, and others, especially the once Black-friendly Déjà Vu. She notes the positive effects of increasing LGBTQ visibility yet thinks that it drives some back into hiding for fear of being identified with it. While Goodman uses social media to help influence people to embrace their true selves, she laments the abuse of dating apps. She concludes the interview with her thoughts on gentrification in Charleston, and the need of leaving a legacy, especially being Black and gay. Note: This interview was conducted when the narrator preferred male pronouns. The narrator now uses she/her pronouns and requested they be changed. The pronouns were substituted and are bracketed in the transcript, but they were not altered, or removed, from the audio file.
Stephen “Steve” Cagle (pronouns: He/Him/His) discusses his upbringing in North Carolina, education as a pharmacist, service in the armed forces, his experiences as a gay man in the South, abroad and in California, and eventually opening a gay bed and breakfast with his domestic partner, Charles S. Holt, at Folly Beach, SC. Born in Concord NC, he grew up with an ailing father who died young, and a mother who struggled to find her son positive male role models. Knowing he was gay from an early age, Cagle, while having sexual experiences, kept quiet about his orientation in his hometown where such things were not discussed, but not necessarily condemned. He had somewhat closeted affairs when he attended pharmacy school at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. Drafted into the army, Cagle, wanting to serve his country to fulfill his father’s inability to do so, found a fairly tolerant attitude to gays in the military. Despite others being out, he was more reserved, yet he mentions sexual experiences at bases at home and abroad in his service in northern Italy. After leaving the service Cagle lived in Henderson, NC, and then in Charlotte, NC, working as a pharmacist. He describes a gay bar in Charlotte sharing a site with a Denny’s Restaurant and explains the allure and dangers of anonymous sex in rest stops on the Interstate 85 Highway corridor in North Carolina, mentioning a Highway Patrolman who frequented those sites. Having been raised an only child and feeling he lacked social skills in befriending people, Cagle did find relationships, eventually falling in love with a married US Marine who suggested Cagle move to California in 1977 to be near him. There, the affair ended, as Cagle knew it would, but he met Charles (Chuck) Holt, who worked in Los Angeles, reading film scripts and crossing paths with celebrities such as Liberace and Rock Hudson. The men became a couple, and they began to explore their options in 1986 after Holt discovered he was HIV positive. The couple pulled up stakes, began an extended road trip across the country, guided by Damron’s Gay Guides, and ended up founding and running the gay Charleston Bed and Breakfast at Folly Beach. Cagle discusses the place’s importance, its success, the friendly acceptance it met on Folly Beach, also mentioning Hurricane Hugo, and how others, including his mother, came to accept him and help run the B and B after Holt’s death in 1995. Cagle sold the B and B, retired from the Ralph Johnson Veterans Administration Hospital and now lives in Charleston with his husband John Meffert.
Pat Patterson (pronouns: He/Him/His) speaks of family life, childhood, growing up, coming out, his political activism through drag performance, interactions with the Methodist Church, and his perceptions of the LGBTQ community. Born and reared in a loving and accepting family environment in Spartanburg, SC, he attended Wofford College, the 37th family member to do so. “I’m a Palmetto tree with fairly deep roots,” he notes. He came out in graduate school at the University of SC, and speaks about the founding of its Bisexual Gay and Lesbian Association (BGLA) and how he assumed his drag persona Patti O’Furniture, “a bully pulpit to raise awareness,” on a dare. At various points in the interview, Patterson speaks of the stratification of the LGBTQ community (“part of our charm and part of our problem”), with most of the focus on Charleston, identifying the conservative “blazer gays” who practice “an odd social decorum” at private parties, the “SIN” or service industry gays who are more out, and other socially and geographically distanced groups. He speaks of racism, and racial and trans insensitivity, the difference between the Charleston Pride and the Columbia, SC-based South Carolina Pride organizations, the gay rugby team, the Charleston Blockade, and K. J. Ivery, once a student of his and now an out trans officer of the Charleston Police Department. Having first done AIDS work in Columbia, SC with his friend Bill Edens, he became involved with the SC Equality Coalition, and he mentions a variety of other LGBTQ organizations and leaders. He began commuting to Charleston to perform drag at the bar Patrick’s, eventually moving there, arranging performances at Dudley’s, and he now also performs at brunches, breweries and bingo, usually emceeing, giving his tips from the audience to charity and passing the hat at performances for different causes and organizations. Straight audiences, he notes, are often more appreciative, and in describing his own indoctrination into drag, he shares some of the vocabulary, mentions those icons who influenced him and praises Jay White for his Brooke Collins performances. He names and describes many bars throughout the state, speaks of his evolution as a performer and activist, as well as the need to be aware of how unintended insults or slurs can occur. Making distinctions between religion and faith, the latter very important to him, Patterson also describes his family’s attachment to their local Methodist congregation in Spartanburg and their dedication to liberalizing the Methodist Church in general.
Blanche McCrary Boyd (pronouns: she/her/hers) describes the events that lead to her becoming an acclaimed novelist and professor at Connecticut College. Born in Charleston, SC in 1945 to working class parents, she lost her father at age 15, one of the crucial events of her life. Living with family on a 400-acre plantation near Rantowles, SC, she became “radicalized” by events seen on television, realizing, unlike other members of her family, that she lived in a racist society, finding a “sense of horror” and a “sense of beauty” in the South. She attended Duke University and met Dean Boyd, the man she married, while attending Harvard University summer school. Boyd credits her husband for helping her mature and encouraging her writing once she decided upon that as a goal. Moving to California, Boyd began writing seriously at Pomona College, and won a Wallace Stegner Fellowship in creative writing at Stanford University. Her marriage unraveled, as she discovered feminism, and her attraction to women, bringing her to a “different reality.” She had starting drinking alcohol soon after her father’s death and she spent over a decade abusing it and drugs as she moved to New York and became a “radical lesbian.” She helped set type for the classic novel Rubyfruit Jungle by Rita Mae Brown, and founded Sagaris, an “institute for feminist thought,” associating with leading feminists, including accused bomber Patricia Swinton. She published essays, mostly about the South, in The Village Voice, learned how to “seize” her authority, and published books on popular musicians under the name Vivian Claire. She returned to Charleston, continuing writing and publishing novels, becoming sober in 1981. She discusses how a teenage car wreck involving a Black man’s death became the “fulcrum of my understanding of life” and how it serves as a metaphor for America as she wonders “what white people who are anti-racist are going to do about white supremacy.” She and her wife Leslie are the mothers of twins, James and Julia, and Boyd reflects on parenting, Leslie’s life-threatening illnesses, and how her novel Tomb of the Unknown Racist has capped her fiction writing career. As retirement from Connecticut College looms, she assesses her accomplishments, notes satisfactions, and the many surprising turns her life took.
K. J. Ivery (pronouns: He/Him/His), the first openly trans officer with the Charleston Police Department, discusses growing up, coming into his sexuality and gender identity, schooling, family relations and a variety of other topics. A Charleston native, Ivery grew up in a religious family where sexual non-conformity was not encouraged, and in a city where one faced further discrimination for being both Black and queer. He experienced difficulties with his parents after identifying as bisexual in middle school. Later identifying as gay, Ivery had a girlfriend in high school. He speaks of using the internet to find information and peers while in school, having attended Charles Towne Academy and later the Academic Magnet High School. He found the latter place very accepting, despite not being permitted to start a Gay-Straight Alliance, which he nevertheless did, using a different name to mask it. Identifying as trans-masculine, he discusses how he didn't come out to his family until he was identified in the Post & Courier as an openly transgender police officer. He began to investigate this part of his identity while attending the University of South Carolina, in Columbia, where he again was very active in its Gay-Straight Alliance. Ivery was impressed with Columbia's Harriet Hancock Center, and he discusses the arbitrariness and social constructs of gender, speaks of the "awesome things about... identifying as queer" and expresses delight in not being trapped in the limitations of being a cis-gender male, while also discussing the stud/femme roles prevalent in some lesbian communities. Having majored in criminology, he returned to Charleston in 2012 and immediately began working with the Charleston Police Department, which he lauds for its openness and high standards, and which adapted easily to his transitioning. On the force, he first worked in West Ashley neighborhoods before moving to the tourist districts downtown, while serving as an LGBT liaison to the community, which he describes as cliquish, and stratified along economic, racial and even geographic lines. He has worked with We Are Family, the Alliance for Full Acceptance (helping to administer the Trans Love Fund), Charleston Area Trans Support (CATS), and the Charleston YOUth Count, as well as founding a trans-masculine support and social group. He describes his relationship with his wife, Sam Diamond, the marriage ceremony they created and which their families attended, and how society looks at and presumes it understands the dynamics of their interracial marriage. He contrasts his spirituality compared to his family's rigid religious beliefs, voicing his respect for them and their views and noting the growing acceptance by his parents and siblings. Before concluding he also addresses gentrification in Charleston, specifically in regard to his grandparents' home on Line Street, his attendance at an early Charleston Pride Parade, his social life, and the advancements and progress of the LGBTQ community.
Michael Lott (pronouns: He/Him/His). In the first of two oral history interviews, Michael Lott discusses his early years, his family, coming out, training and practice as a psychiatrist, his personal and professional life in New York City in the era of AIDS, and his health and retirement. Born in Norfolk, VA, he grew up in the Charleston, SC area on James Island, closely connected to his mother and grandfather, but alienated from his father, whom he was told was his stepfather until he was eight. Deeply religious, he would try “to pray the gay away” after various youthful sexual encounters, even as he mentions religious figures who were gay. He began college at Furman and finished at the College of Charleston, experiencing and describing closeted gay life on campus, in bars, like the Garden and Gun Club, and the city. Engaged briefly, he broke that off and was condemned for his sexual orientation by his Campus Crusade for Christ friends. His own near-death and the death of his brother prompted him to begin living an authentic life as he began his studies at the Medical University of South Carolina (MUSC) in 1980. He briefly mentions being on a plane hijacked to Cuba along with a gay CIA agent, and speaks more fully of homophobia at MUSC aimed at him and at an early AIDS patient at Charleston County Hospital. Serving on national medical school boards and committees, he engaged in gay and lesbian related causes, continuing his education in San Francisco (under a doctor who was a part of the Dan White murder trial) and did his residency in New York City, as it experienced the crises of AIDS, crack, and homelessness. Moving there in 1985 as “a farm boy from South Carolina” he eventually ran “with the Saint [disco] crowd”, partied with “beautiful people” on Fire Island and eventually became known as “the Tommy Tune of Death” for helping choreograph the exits of many friends lost to AIDS. He taught at New York University before “selling out” to work for drug companies, eventually going on disability due to his own HIV status. A slow progressor, diagnosed in 1989, he did not go on medications until 2016. Lott moved to Asheville, NC in 2019 and was settling in when the COVID-19 pandemic began. He speaks favorably of the city’s liberal attitudes and ends speaking about the sadness of all his losses but his happiness that younger LGBTQ people have not had to endure experiences similar to his.
Shelli Quenga (pronouns: She/Hers), describes living all over the world, moving to Charleston in her 20s and coming out as a lesbian in her 40s. Her father was in the Air Force, and she discusses her experiences being the daughter of a mixed-race couple with a Guamanian father and a white mother. Educated at Vassar, she married twice. Although she had a gay uncle, “it just never occurred to me that being gay was an option,” she states. Married with one child, she met another woman with four children (two withs special needs) and their relationship began; the coming out process was “tortuous.” During it, she lost a relationship with her daughter, her parents, and her job due to its homophobic work environment. Quenga discusses how her experience differs from that of lesbians who never married men, noting her realization that heterosexuality did give her more power and status. She speaks of her obliviousness to LGBTQ people and issues before coming out and her limited awareness of the Charleston LGBTQ community. That changed once she met Lynn Dugan and began to attend functions organized by the Charleston Social Club, a local lesbian group that Dugan founded. She describes the pressure she feels to keep her personal and business lives separate, including on social media, while also observing how such mundane things as health care forms can be off-putting to LGBTQ people and express subtle discrimination. With the passage of time, she has become more vocal in order to demonstrate to others how misleading or stereotypical their assumptions about her can be, and she has found a shift in those around her, too. She and her wife have been accepted by their extended families, their children now have LGBTQ friends, and Quenga discusses how they keep her up to date with terminology and issues in the community. She mentions the rupture in the congregation of Old St. Andrews Episcopal Church over the ordination of a gay bishop, and ends the interview discussing racism and sexism in South Carolina, and how an inability to be fully free and out causes her to question staying in the state. Her advice for younger people, however, is to leave the state, achieve success not possible here, and then perhaps come back.
Douglas Seymour (pronouns: He/Him/His) relates the story of his abusive childhood, growing up and attending school and college in Charleston, SC, his life as an adult, and his work as a peer navigator for people with HIV, often speaking forcefully on the corrosive impact of homophobia. He was beaten by his father for not liking sports and cars, and, although he adored his mother, she told him “being gay was worse than being a child molester and a child murderer.” He always knew he was attracted to men, and if “there hadn’t been the hitch of being told it was wrong...it would have been a natural flow into adulthood.” He graduated First Baptist High School, and due to his father’s demands, attended the Citadel, terrified that he would be picked on for being gay. There, however, he found acceptance among upperclassmen for his knowledge of pop music and found other gay cadets. Having started frequenting the bar Basin Street South as an underage teen, he began going to the King Street Garden and Gun Club, and Seymour recalls his times there and that era of the late 1970s and early 1980s as one of the happiest periods of his life. After college, he worked as a journalist in Summerville, SC, and he describes the cliquish nature of Charleston gay life at the time. His lack of self-esteem, he says, prompted his alcoholism and his settling into personal relationships that were often abusive. He lived in Washington, DC, from 1982 to 1991 and returned to Charleston with a diagnosis of AIDS, told by physicians to prepare to die. After living with his parents, and coming out to them, he moved into his own apartment and received health care from his physician and Lowcountry AIDS Services. Facing health crises, he quit drinking and quit smoking, hired a personal trainer and was in the best shape of his life in his fifties. He began to work for the local Ryan White program as a peer navigator for people newly diagnosed or those long-term survivors like himself. Seymour describes some of the social support programs he set up and notes the quandary of “a whole bunch of us gay men...[with] no career, no retirement...because we weren’t supposed to be here, and now we’re older, we’re isolated...[and] it kind of feels like nobody wants you.” The interview ends with reflections on the lack of a variety of specific spaces for LGBTQ people and how Charleston has changed over the years.
Alma Lopez and Mario Puga were born in Mexico. In this interview, they focus on their experiences as workers. Puga tells he started working at a young age with his father and asserts children mature quickly in Mexico. As a young man, he joined his brothers in Rhode Island, where he finished high school. When he returned to Mexico, he met Lopez. She worked in housekeeping. Later, both separately immigrated to the United States. Lopez was with her family in Johns Island and Puga joined her. There both worked in agriculture and progressively moved to less physically demanding jobs. Lopez learned English at Our Lady of Mercy and became active in the community. In 2015, she opened a cleaning business. In 2020, the COVID pandemic caused a severe decrease in revenue in her business. Seeking a way to support themselves during these trying times, they decided to dig into their cultural roots and sell food. They knew there was a need: Latino workers did not have a place to buy breakfast in the morning. Lopez and Puga discuss the nuances of the food truck business and assert that it is a very tiring activity. They state the biggest reward in this endeavor is to share their food with their clients and receive their appreciation.
Joseph Goodson was born on January 23, 1930, in McBee, South Carolina, and grew up in nearby Darlington. The only son of a widowed mother, enrolled in The Citadel following a campus visit to a friend who was a member of the Corps of Cadets. After graduation (1951), he joined the US Marine Corps with three classmates and was commissioned as a second lieutenant. He completed the Officers’ Basic Course at Quantico, VA, and was assigned to an anti-aircraft artillery unit, the 2nd 90mm Anti-Aircraft Artillery Battalion at Camp Lejune, NC, in early 1952. Goodson planned to apply for flight training, but on the recommendation of his commanding officer was assigned to command an artillery battery in Korea. He reflects on his experience in Korea during the time just after the Armistice was signed in 1953. He also discusses his Marine career during the 1950s and a tour in Vietnam in 1968 during the Tet Offensive and the defense of Khe Sahn. Goodson also offers observations on life at The Citadel during the period between WWII and the Korean War and contemplates the impact attending The Citadel had on his life and career. Goodson returned to The Citadel in 1972 and spent the next three years as Commanding Officer of the NROTC Unit. He discusses the question of hazing in some cadet organizations during this period. After his retirement from the Marines in 1975, he stayed on in various administrative positions at The Citadel until 1990. He lives in Mt. Pleasant, South Carolina.
Houston, Texas native Jessica Maas had no intention of enrolling in a military college after graduating from high school. But a visit to The Citadel in Charleston, South Carolina, solidified her decision to take on the challenges this military school offered, despite several offers to play collegiate-level volleyball at other schools. Maas explains, “I came on campus, and my coaches were talking to me about the challenge and how it would be a different situation from most college students, and that you wouldn't get the normal experience. Once I heard their pitch and heard that it would be a challenge for me, I couldn't turn it down, and I knew that I would regret it if I didn't see if I could handle it, and see if I could excel.” In 2011, four years after first stepping through the Citadel's gates, Maas graduated with a bachelor’s degree in Political Science, proving she had indeed handled every challenge The Citadel had to offer. In her interview, Maas relates her experiences at The Citadel as a female athlete, discussing topics such as gender relationships, friendships, faith, and the leadership styles she encountered. Jessica also recalls her best and worst moments during her four years at college, from academic challenges, to reminiscing about favorite classes.
Susan Breslin was born in Pittsfield, Massachusetts. In the summer of 1963, she joined The Congress of Racial Equality (CORE) in Harlem after graduating from the University of Toronto. In recalling her time with the organization, Breslin talks about the intense work she performed with the TV Image Campaign, a movement devised by CORE to force major companies to use integrated advertisement. She also discusses the significance of the August, 1963 March on Washington, stating, “I think everybody who participated in the March on Washington—and they came from everywhere—walked away knowing they were part of something huge.” Breslin’s interview dives into the rich depths of CORE’s history; specifically the evolution of its ideology. Breslin discusses the controversy that bubbled up when some CORE leaders advocated for separation instead of integration, and the resulting break that led her to leave the group in the fall of 1965. Breslin also shares her memories of major historical events such as the funerals of Malcolm X and Martin Luther King, Jr. She reflects on how her participation in the civil rights movement impacted her personal relationships, discusses the emotional quality of those times, and encourages her audience to find the issue of their time and become involved. Breslin believes, as she says, “Every little step creates controversy, but the controversy does not last. What lasts is the door that has been opened.” Later, Breslin moved to South Carolina, and now resides in Folly Beach, where she continues to be active in local political issues.
Before settling in the Lowcountry in the late 1990s, Pilar resided with her husband and her young son in the city of Mendoza, Argentina. Pilar worked as a teacher and her husband worked for a company called Villavicencio. The young couple was able to meet their obligations and attend to the needs of their child until a reduction of staff left her husband out of work. Like so many other Argentines hit by the economic crisis, after unsuccessfully looking for work for months, disillusioned and desperate, her husband decided to try his luck abroad. A few months later Pilar joined him. In the interview, Pilar tells about the process of preparing to emigrate and the adaptation to the new life in the Lowcountry. She recalls the people and programs that helped her in her journey and reflects on how the experience of migrating affected the family’s roles and dynamics as well as the construction of her own identity.Antes de establecerse en el Lowcountry a fines de los años noventa, Pilar residía junto a su esposo y su hijo pequeño en la ciudad de Mendoza, Argentina. Pilar trabajaba como maestra y su esposo lo hacía en la empresa Villavicencio. La joven pareja era capaz de afrontar sus obligaciones y atender a las necesidades de su niño hasta que una reducción de personal deja a su marido sin trabajo. Como tantos otros argentinos golpeados por la crisis económica, después de buscar trabajo infructuosamente por meses, desilusionado y desesperado, su esposo decidió probar suerte en el exterior. Unos meses después Pilar, se le unió. En la entrevista Pilar cuenta como fue el proceso de prepararse para partir y la adaptación a la vida en el Lowcountry. Recuerda las personas y programas que la ayudaron en este proceso y reflexiona acerca de cómo la experiencia de migrar afectó la dinámica de los roles familiares como así también la construcción de su propia identidad.
Civil rights activist and educator Dr. Luther Seabrook was born in Charleston, South Carolina on December 5, 1928. He spent his childhood in downtown Charleston until his parents enrolled him at Lincoln Academy, a boarding school for black children in North Carolina. After finishing high school, he went to West Virginia for his undergraduate studies, obtained a master’s degree in education at Columbia University, and later earned a doctorate in education administration from the University of Massachusetts. In his interview, Seabrook remembers his experiences with the civil rights movement in the 1960s. He explains that, after facing the pervasiveness of racism and discrimination at Columbia University and from New York City officials, he joined the Congress of Racial Equality (CORE). With CORE, Seabrook worked to bring about change primarily through the housing and education initiatives. In the summer of 1964, he volunteered to go to Mississippi and collaborate with the Student Non-Violent Coordinating Committee (SNCC), despite the disappearance of three civil rights activists. SNCC leaders sent him to Hattiesburg, where he remained and worked with the Freedom Schools until the end of the summer. Seabrook also recalls his other activities, such as his participation in the Democratic Convention in Atlantic City, attendance of the Selma march, and involvement in a march on Washington. But Seabrook’s impact didn’t stop at civil rights; he also had a successful career in education. In his roles as both a principal and a superintendent, Seabrook was a central figure in the development of the New York and Boston school systems. For his work, he received numerous accolades and awards from various parties. Though Seabrook worked mostly in the North, he returned to South Carolina and worked at the State Department of Education with Dr. Barbara Nielsen in the 1990s.
Janie Campbell was born in Moffett near Edisto Island, South Carolina, and raised in New Jersey. There, she worked in a group home for youth with disabilities and served as Chief Shop Steward for the American Federation of State, County, and Municipal Employees, (AFSCME). In 1991,she reluctantly left her job and returned to South Carolina for family reasons. After holding various jobs in the region, she began working as a sanitation worker with the City of Charleston in 1997. She was one of six women employed by the department at the time and recalls some initial embarrassment at riding on the back of a truck. With the encouragement of male coworkers, however, she became a driver. Campbell took part in two failed efforts to unionize the sanitation workers in order to bolster their pay and improve their working conditions. She discusses the poor working conditions in the department as well as the difficulties of sustaining a union in South Carolina.
Jacquelyn Elaine Venning was born in Charleston, South Carolina, where she spent most of her life. Venning describes being raised in a Christian family and her experience in private schools, including Sacred Heart Catholic School and Bishop England, where she was educated until eleventh grade. Venning graduated from Burke High School in 1983. Venning recalls her first job as a shampoo girl, which she got in sixth grade and continued to work at through her schooling. After high school, Venning relates how she fell in love and got married. Her husband then joined the military, which relocated them around the world. Venning describes her experience living internationally in Germany, and in Texas and Georgia before returning to Charleston in 1992. Since then, she has been working with Aramark at The Citadel, first serving in the Mess Hall and later serving as a supervisor in the Daniel Library Java City. In her interview, Venning recalls her apprehension of working in The Citadel’s male-only environment. But she states that her fears quickly dissipated and describes the cadets as having always been gentle and respectful with her and her job enjoyable. Venning recounts the many institutional changes she has experienced during her than twenty-plus years working at The Citadel, including the deeply controversial admission of Sharon Faulkner to the school and later the full inclusion of women to the Corps. Venning concludes with how the food industry has changed over the years and the attempts to unionize The Citadel food workers.
Bordallo was born in San Pedro Coahuila, Mexico, where she lived with her parents and six brothers until moving to the United States. Her father was a milliner and businessman. In 1978, she got married and crossed the border with her new husband. They arrived in Florida and stayed to work in agriculture, from there traveling to Virginia, the Carolinas, Tennessee, Georgia, and anywhere they were needed. They had three children. In 1986, they decided to settle on Johns Island because they wanted a more stable life and better educational opportunities for their children. They kept working on the fields and lived in a camp located on River Road. There, they met the sisters of Our Lady of Mercy, who visited the families and helped them to access community resources. Aspiring to a better quality of life for her family, Bordallo strove to acquire their own house through Habitats for Humanity. Bordallo and her husband regularized their legal status by accepting the amnesty granted by the Reagan administration and later became US citizens.Bordallo nació en San Pedro Coahuila, México y allí vivió junto a sus padres y seis hermanos hasta que emigró a Estados Unidos. Su padre fabricaba sombreros y se dedicaba a los negocios. En 1978, se casó y con su flamante marido cruzó la frontera. Se instalaron en Florida para trabajar en el campo y desde allí viajaban a Virginia, las Carolinas, Tennessee, Virginia, Georgia, donde quiera que hubiera trabajo en la cosecha. Tuvieron tres hijos. En 1986 pensando en el bien y la educación de los niños decidieron establecerse en Johns Island. Al campo donde vivían, ubicado en River Road, comenzaron a llegar de visita las hermanas de Our Lady of Mercy y ellas los ayudaron a acceder a recursos comunitarios. Aspirando a una mejor calidad de vida para su familia luchó para conseguir su propia vivienda con Habitat for Humanity. Bordallo y su esposo se acogieron a la amnistía otorgada por el gobierno del presidente Reagan y más tarde se convirtieron en ciudadanos americanos.
In the second part of her interview, Bordallo recalls how her life changed after her family settled on Johns Island and explains how the island's Latino community has grown in recent years. Bordallo explains that their family has always valued education very highly, and, for that reason, she and her husband did not hesitate to invest their efforts in sending their children to private Catholic schools, first to Nativity and later to Bishop England. Bordallo is also proud of having paid for her children’s college education costs, and is happy to say they are now independent adults, giving her the opportunity to pursue her own projects, study, and travel. Bordallo works as a young children's teacher at Rural Mission, is a student at Trident Technical College, and remains an active member of Holy Spirit Parish on Johns Island. En esta segunda parte de la entrevista, Bordallo recuerda como cambió su vida después que su familia se estableció en Johns Island y describe cómo la comunidad latina de la isla ha crecido en los últimos años. Bordallo explica que la educación siempre ha sido un valor muy importante para su familia y que, por esa razón, ella y su esposo no dudaron en invertir sus esfuerzos para que sus hijos fueran a escuelas privadas católicas, primero a Nativity y más tarde a Bishop England. Bordallo se enorgullece también de haber pagado por los estudios universitarios de sus hijos y tener la capacidad, ahora que ellos son adultos independientes, de abocarse a sus propios proyectos, estudiar y viajar. Bordallo trabaja como maestra de niños pequeños en Rural Mission, estudia en Trident Tech y es miembro activo de la parroquia Holy Spirit en Johns Island.
Carl Roberts was born in Spartanburg, South Carolina in 1929. His father and mother worked in a cotton mill. He was one of seven boys and had one sister. Roberts enlisted in the Navy when he was 17-years old and attended basic training in Maryland. He was assigned to the USS Leyte aircraft carrier as a Seaman First Class in the Pacific at the end of the Second World War. He later joined the Army and was stationed in Seoul during the Korean War where he worked in the motor pool, acquiring mechanical skills and learning to drive various vehicles. He received the Victory Medal for service in World War II, the Good Conduct Medal for service in the Korean War, and the Honorable Service button. After leaving the service, he was a sheet metal worker at Beverage Air in Spartanburg. In the 1960’s, Roberts moved to Charleston to work as an automatic transmission mechanic and to begin a family. He married and had three children.
Charles W. Smith discusses growing up, his adult professional life as a city planner and realtor, his personal life and his work as an activist for LGBTQ rights. His family lived in Orangeburg, Beaufort, Florence and Charleston and he was educated at the College of Charleston and Clemson University, moving to Miami in 1984. His early family life was overshadowed by the illness and death of an older brother. Realizing he was gay, he avoided being bullied in school by staying closeted. In 1987 in Miami Beach, FL, he met Carlos Guillermo Rodriguez. Soon after, Smith told his family he was gay and Rodriguez tested HIV positive. He wanted Smith to leave him, but Smith refused; their families in South Carolina and Colombia, South America accepted them. Trinity Episcopal Cathedral in Miami, with which Smith was affiliated as a senior warden, was also accepting and affirming. After his lover’s death in 1995, Smith, who had run for political office, but lost, moved to Charleston, SC in 1996, finding a changed city, which he attributes to Mayor Joseph P. Riley, Jr. We Are Family, a youth-oriented LGBTQ organization had been founded by Thomas Myers and Smith stayed, founding a real estate firm catering to LGBTQ clients. There were a number of bars in town he remembers frequenting; he affiliated with St. Stephen’s Episcopal Church, a historically African American congregation opened up to white congregants, many of whom were LGBTQ. Smith and others, mostly non natives, such as Linda Ketner, Jim and Warren Redman-Gress, Carolyn Kirk, Lynne Moldenhauer and Linda G. William, helped found Alliance for Full Acceptance (AFFA). They publicly confronted a newspaper ad attacking LGBTQ people. This, Smith believes, began the process of removing shame and empowering the LGBTQ community. Smith also describes the “thousand year rainfall event” of 2015 and his marriage to Rob Suli that year, in a Columbia, SC hospital to ensure their rights were respected in the arena of health care. He notes the importance of the internet to LGBTQ people in finding community. He mentions Lowcountry Gay and Lesbian Alliance (LGLA), the lives of Jay Edgar Hoover and Clyde Tolson in Miami, and two gay men, who wintered in Charleston, SC. They, according to Smith, participated in the gay purges of US State Department employees in the 1940s and ‘50s. He also mentions the ownership of gay bars in Charleston, SC and the conflict over LGBTQ rights that has split the local Episcopal Diocese.
Taylor DeBartola tells the story of his upbringing in Peachtree City, Georgia, a town he describes as “very conservative.” He discusses the competitive relationship he had with his younger brother who is close in age, as well as the role that religion played in their early life. DeBartola reflects on the way that he revealed his sexuality to his family, and the period of time where things between them were rocky, discussing the ways in which he had to be patient and allow his parents to “take their time” to accept him. Taylor then talks about his “chosen family,” and the way they all met at Dudley’s, a popular gay bar in downtown Charleston. He details the ways he sees gatherings with gay men changing in recent years, moving from public spaces to more private locations such as personal residences. Taylor also discusses gay married life in the South, later noting that he and his now-husband were “engaged when it was not going to be legal,” and stressing that young people should educate themselves on gay history, especially the HIV/AIDS crisis, which he stresses is far from over. He also talks about the ways that particular books shaped him and his desire to learn more about gay history, mentioning Harlan Greene’s Why We Never Danced the Charleston. DeBartola then describes the impact that artist and activist David Wojnarowicz has had on his life, and the ways that he has tried to trace Wojnarowicz’s and his partner’s time spent on a trip to Charleston. Finally, Taylor talks about his experiences being an openly gay College of Charleston student.
At a “Unity in the Community” Forum sponsored by the Alliance for Full Acceptance (AFFA), Reverend Robert Arrington answers questions posed to him by female impersonator/performer Symone N. O’Bishop and members of the audience. After introductions by emcee Regina Duggins (aka Gina Mocha), Arrington speaks of his personal life, conditions in the lowcountry, and the development and evolution of his open and affirming Charleston Unity Fellowship Church. He describes growing up in Durham, NC, and living in Rochester, NY, before moving to Charleston, a place he finds not as progressive or easy to live as elsewhere. He mentions a dysfunctional childhood, being misdiagnosed with learning disabilities, and recalls various phases of his life, including being married to woman, being a female impersonator, being HIV positive for thirty years, and the love he now shares with his husband, stating that they were the first “out” African American gay male couple in the area to have a house built for them by Habitat for Humanity. Most of the interview, however, focuses on the growth of his church, his plans for it, and the need to be completely transparent in all aspects of one’s life, including one’s spiritual life. He and O’Bishop discuss the behavior of some closeted LGBTQ church goers, who hide their sexual and emotional lives to worship under ministers who preach against homosexuality. The only “out” African American minister in the area, Arrington describes his church as Pentecostal-related and its policy of accepting every one of every sexual orientation, identification and race. He responds to an HIV-positive transgender woman of color asking how to find a loving relationship; he and the interviewer also discuss sexually irresponsible behavior and strategies for finding a life partner. Prompted by other queries from the audience, Reverend Arrington agrees that there is a need for more coordination with his church and the community it represents with other agencies in the area. An audience member comments further that there must be a new attitude regarding such participation: instead of asking to be included, one must demand that inclusion. The interview ends with Chase Glenn of AFFA and others describing programs and initiatives of related interest in the area. A call for action results with applause at the comment that this forum may mark a new direction for one of Charleston’s marginalized communities.
Andrew Becknell, sometimes known as Andrezia (pronouns: they/them, but also she/her) describes growing up in the Charleston area as a bigender or two-spirit person. They grew up in a conservative Catholic family, moving from West of the Ashley to Mount Pleasant. Becknell's parents divorced when they were young, and they became close to their mother, and has only recently begun to renew ties with their father. Becknell has Tourette's syndrome, misdiagnosed early on as Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD), leading to bad reactions to drugs and an unhappy year at Blessed Sacrament School. Later attending Wando High School, Becknell, who always sensed they were different, began experimenting with high heels and other forms of feminine attire, eliciting a range of both negative and positive reaction, the former from his family and the latter from a church youth group leader. Attending Trident Technical College, Becknell served as Vice President of Gay/Straight Alliance, which they helped found and later had both positive and negative experiences in a different work environments. Now working as a car-detailer, a job much enjoyed, Becknell discusses being out, "blending in," and also moving into "survival mode." Becknell mentions attending some Charleston Area Transgender Support (CATS) meetings, notes being more attracted to women, describes the impact of certain albums and musicians on them, declares that "The binary must die," and speaks of their attraction to Norse Polytheism. They also muse on the rigidity of the older generation, both straight and gay, in viewing of sex and gender roles, mentioning a lesbian "takeover" of the Alliance for Full Acceptance (AFFA), making the organization more accepting. Becknell also discusses work with a number of therapists, and how a gender therapist has been most helpful.
Robert Arrington (pronouns: He/Him/His), Black reverend of the Unity Fellowship Church, the only affirming church for LGBTQ people of color in the Charleston, SC area, discusses his personal life, his spiritual growth, and troubles and issues with his church and the larger Charleston, SC community. A native of Harlem, NY, Arrington grew up in an abusive household and due to a misdiagnosis, was sent to schools for the mentally handicapped. "My childhood was just about survival," he notes. Being different, he was the subject of contempt by others and sought solace in religion and the church, where he was told he was gifted. After being sent to a rigorous all male Catholic School, and his father's murder in 1974, Arrington and his family moved to a rural area near Durham, NC, where he graduated high school. In college, he married a woman "to make everybody happy," but that did not work out, and, moving to Fayetteville, NC, he became involved in a party scene, contracted HIV and nearly died. Back in Durham, facing family issues, Arrington rejoined the church, started an AIDS ministry, and could not be ordained as a minister in the Missionary Baptist Church as a gay man but only as "a non-practicing homosexual." To preserve his integrity, he joined the Unity Fellowship Church movement, and had a congregation in Charlotte, NC. Arrington then gives a brief history of the denomination, noting how he moved to Rochester, NY before coming to Charleston in 2010 and setting up a Pentecostal type church service here. Arrington describes the growth and decline of his congregation, mentions an ex-husband, and speaks of the prejudice he has felt in Charleston directed against him as an African American, and specifically against him as a reverend in and out LGBTQ church. While loving the area, he comments on the resistance of "gatekeepers" to change, feeling that racism is "in the air." He comments favorably on many working to improve the LGBTQ and African American communities, but concludes that many with power and privilege are halting progress.
Lee Anne Leland (pronouns: She/Hers) now living in McClellanville, SC, tells her story of coming to terms with and exploring her identity as a self-identified gender-nonconforming, lesbian, transgender woman. Being raised as a boy in a family of five siblings, she grew up in a prominent, socially and religiously conservative Mount Pleasant family where she struggled to understand and come to terms with her identity facing the disapproval of many. She describes a continuing and confusing search for self-expression and the impact such words as “cross-dresser” and “transsexual” had on her and her search for community, until, with the help of friends, she found her transgender identity. She recounts how she dealt with coming out, her experience with depression, thoughts of suicide, dysphoria over her appearance, various work experiences, and self-acceptance as an adult. Through all of this, Leland discusses the love and support she has received from her wife, Cindy, and the role she has had as an activist. Leland continues as coordinator of the Charleston Area Transgender Support (CATS), a board member of We Are Family, and a speaker at public events such as Transgender Day of Remembrance. She discusses how she perceives that claiming and living her authentic existence, even walking down the street, can be an act of political activism. Leland stresses the need for conversations and political activism especially in the political climate of 2018. Additionally, Leland recounts experiences and histories of Charleston’s gay bars, specifically the Lion’s Head, and the King Street Garden and Gun Club. She also mentions White Point Garden as a cruising spot, the Spoleto Festival, and the impact that the transsexual Dawn Langley Hall Simmons had on the Charleston community.
Louis Decimus Rubin, Jr., was born in 1923 in Charleston, South Carolina, the eldest of three children of Jeanette Weinstein and Louis D. Rubin, Sr. Jeanette grew up in Richmond, Virginia, and met Louis Sr. while visiting her sister in Charleston. In this interview, Louis talks about his father and his father's brothers. Uncle Harry worked with Marion Hornik at M. Hornik & Company in Charleston. Uncle Dan took a job at a Birmingham, Alabama, newspaper, and later became a Broadway playwright. He also wrote Hollywood screenplays for Paramount Studios in the 1930s. Uncle Manning, who wrote advertising for M. Marks & Sons Department Store in Charleston, worked for decades, beginning in 1914, for Charleston's Evening Post as a reporter and editor. Louis Sr. was a self-taught electrician and opened Louis Rubin Electrical Company at 333 King Street. Jeanette and Louis Sr. moved the family to Richmond in 1942 to be near her brothers; Louis Sr. had been sickly and Jeanette was struggling to take care of her family. In Richmond, Louis Sr. earned local fame for his weather predictions based on the clouds and became known as the Weather Wizard of Wythe Avenue. Louis Jr. oversaw the revision of his father's book, The Weather Wizard's Cloud Book, published in 1989 by Algonquin Books, which the younger Rubin had founded in 1983. The Rubins were members of Kahal Kadosh Beth Elohim, Charleston's Reform congregation, which, the interviewee recalls, was very small when he was growing up. Boys at the temple were confirmed, but did not have bar mitzvahs. Louis Jr. had only one Jewish friend as a boy; the rest were not Jewish. "Growing up as I did, being a Jew wasn't very important. I didn't define myself as being a Jew." As an adult, Louis thinks of himself primarily as a southerner and considers himself Jewish culturally but not religiously. He compares himself to his brother, Manning, who has embraced his Jewish identity and religion. Louis mentions Charleston natives Sidney Rittenberg, Sr.; Octavus Roy Cohen, Jr., Earl Mazo, and the Mazo families. He describes the differences between what locals at one time referred to as Uptown Jews and Downtown Jews. "We were raised to be snobs." His mother was among those with the attitude that "Orthodox Jews were somehow peasants." He considers the impact of the Holocaust on American Jews, in particular, its role in breaking down the barriers between Charleston's Uptown Jews and Downtown Jews. He adds that economic and social parity played just as much a role in eliminating bias. Louis discusses the assimilation of Jews in America: where once many may have abandoned religious practices that set them apart, he now sees a return to traditional customs. Louis married Eva Redfield, an Episcopalian, in 1951, and they raised two sons, Robert and William, in a secular home. The interviewer references a few of Rubin's many published works, tracing the parallels between his fiction and real life.
Sandra Lee Kahn Rosenblum was born in 1935 in Charleston, South Carolina, the eldest of two children of Julius and Edna Goldberg Kahn, both of whom immigrated to the United States from Lithuania. She talks briefly about her parents' families and how Julius, who lived in Charleston, was introduced to Edna, a Baltimore, Maryland, resident. They married in 1934, and Edna moved to Charleston, where Julius, with his brother Robbie Kahn, was in the wholesale grocery business on East Bay Street. Sometime later, the siblings parted ways, each setting up his own shop on King street. Sandra remembers living in the Frewil Apartments on the corner of Smith and Vanderhorst streets, as a young child, followed by a move to Rutledge Avenue, near Bogard Street, a location she describes as "idyllic." When she was fifteen, the Kahns moved to a house at 45 Spring Street, where her father built a small store on the same lot. She says, the neighborhood was like a "slum," but they could no longer afford the rent for the apartment on Rutledge. "Ultimately, he (Julius) went belly up. . . . He was not a businessman." The Kahns were members of the Orthodox synagogue Beth Israel, but Sandra's mother sent her to Hebrew school at Brith Sholom, the older of the two Orthodox shuls in the city. Sandra was confirmed at Brith Sholom. She discusses with the interviewers Brith Sholom adopting the practice of confirmation for girls. Interviewer Dale Rosengarten notes that she was told by a Beaufort resident that their synagogue began offering confirmation to satisfy mothers who wanted a rite of passage for their daughters. Sandra states that, as a child, being Jewish was a significant part of her identity and the Jewish youth groups Young Judaea and Aleph Zadik Aleph (AZA) were central to her life (she was an AZA Sweetheart). She responds to questions about Brith Sholom's junior congregation; recalls Seymour Barkowitz, her homeroom teacher in high school; and reports that she never experienced any overt antisemitism as a child. Interviewee provided comments and corrections to the transcript during proofing. See the follow-up (Mss. 1035-583) to this interview also conducted on September 28, 2021. For related oral histories, see interviews with Sandra's cousins Ellis Kahn in 1997 (Mss. 1035-142) and Jack Kahn in 1998 (Mss. 1035-182); and Sandra's husband, Raymond Rosenblum, and his siblings in 2008 (Mss. 1035-134).
