Interview of Jane P. de Butts (formerly known as Jane Hanahan), a direct descendant of General Pinckney and niece of Josephine Pinckney. In this interview, she discusses her and her first husband's families and the circumstances of their move from Richmond to 43 East Bay, where they lived and raised a family. She speaks about her daily life at 43 East Bay Street and Charleston in general: raising a family, socializing, recreation including summers at the Isle of Palms, Hurricane Hugo, and her association with Historic Charleston Foundation as a trustee and later as its first woman President. She discusses memorable HCF efforts such as the purchase and restoration of the Missroon House, acquisition of McLeod Plantation, and the Revolving Fund, and comments on how Charleston has changed over the years, specifically the changes brought on by tourism. She also speaks about each of her now grown children, one of whom (Anne), now lives in the George Summers House with her family.
At one time there were so many Schirmers living on Sullivan's Island that the area around Station 19 and the Coast Guard Station earned the nickname, 'Schirmerville.' Ruth DeHaven is a member of that family that can trace its connection with the island back to the marriage of John Elias Schirmer to Helena Sass around 1800. Ruth's father as a young man would canoe to the island with his friends to spend time at a house called the 'Helluvajoint.' As a child, Ruth and her family would pack as many as eight or nine people into their car and as soon as school was out in the spring, drive to Sullivan's Island where they would stay until school started in the fall. Ruth goes on to detail many of the summertime activities she and her family engaged in, including fishing and crabbing on the rocks (jetties), shrimping in the creek, and swimming. After supper the adults usually turned to card games, often joined by 'Vincie' Coste, head of the Coast Guard Station. Other memories revolved around the Coast Guard including the bells that marked the hours, rescues of those in distress, and watching practices with breeches buoys. When the red hurricane flags went up, everyone plus dogs, chickens and goats loaded up the car and headed for Charleston. Ruth also covers relations with Ft. Moultrie, tensions during World War II, internment of German-Americans, disputes over which chickens laid which eggs, and lemon meringue pies. Her family was also close by when a runaway ship hit the Grace Memorial Bridge sending a car with five passengers to their death in 1946. The interview closes with Ruth's impression of the changes that have occurred on the island.
Stephanie Waldron grew up in Kenya on a farm in a house built by her father with no electricity. Later, her mother married Dr. Richard Dominick, who periodically visited Kenya. He was an avid hunter, hunting ducks on Long Island and big game in Kenya. During his visits to Africa they went on safaris, to photograph rather than to hunt. During his youth, Dominick traveled with his family to Coosawhatchie, SC, and developed a love for South Carolina. When he retired from his career as an ophthalmologist, he purchased the Wedge Plantation on the Santee Delta to pursue his lifelong passion of collecting moths. Waldron moved with her mother and siblings during her adolescence to the Wedge. Dominick supervised the renovation of the main house, and built a laboratory for his moth studies called the Bug House. This building also contained a darkroom for color photography development. A steady stream of visitors, scientists and collectors, came to the Wedge. The family had horses, and her stepbrother and stepsister rode often. The family bred thoroughbred racehorses, and Waldron worked with the horses. She reflected on times of the year when deerflies and mosquitoes were rampant. Dr. Dominick died in 1976, and her mother stayed at Wedge another ten years. She described the Wedge property, and recalled trips out to Cedar and Islands. The University of South Carolina purchased Wedge, and it became an institute for the study of mosquito-borne diseases. Waldron stayed on for a while before pursuing her career in film and landscaping. Students came to Wedge, and Waldron ran the kitchen and cooked on her assigned days. Waldron recalled childhood activities from Wedge with her step-siblings. Dr. Dominick had decided at age 40 to no longer hunt, and just observe wildlife. Waldron laughed about locals having trouble understanding her dialect (British). Waldron imagined the amount of labor, and the engineering required, to build all the rice fields in the Santee Delta. She recalled her first time catching shrimp with a seine net at Santee Coastal Reserve with Bill Mace. She expressed her good fortune to have lived for many years in the Santee Delta.
Mike Prevost grew up in Georgetown, SC, and his interest in the outdoors developed in his summers spent at Pawley’s Island. He became an avid duck hunter, and his experiences in rice fields inspired his career in coastal habitat ecology. Prevost received his BS from the University of Georgia (UGA) in 1973, and afterward was employed for three years with the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service on the Georgia coast. He returned to UGA for a Masters, studying under Dr. Sydney Johnson, and did his thesis fieldwork at Kinloch Plantation in the Santee Delta on brackish marsh waterfowl foods. Prevost received mentoring from Kinloch’s manager, Kenny Williams, as well as from Phil Wilkinson. After completing his degree, he was employed by SC Department of Health and Environmental Control (DHEC) working on mosquito control, particularly on understanding the ecology of the mosquito and source reduction. Prevost moved on to employment with SC Wildlife Marine Resources Department (SCMRD) with a focus on waterfowl habitat. The range of his work was from Savannah to Georgetown, and he spent much of his time in the Santee Delta. The work in the outdoors provided a number of challenges: biting insects, equipment issues, and the need to often improvise. Part of his time with SCMRD included working at Bear Island in Colleton County, and during that time the concept of the ACE Basin Project evolved. Prevost became a coordinator for the ACE Basin Task Force. After the ACE Basin Project he went to work full time for The Nature Conservancy as the project director for the Sewee To Santee landscape. In 2010, Prevost had the opportunity to go to work for White Oak Forestry Corporation, a subsidiary of Evening Post Industries. White Oak Forestry consists of 17,000 acres in the lower Santee Delta, and was established by Peter Manigault, a visionary conservationist who was the first landowner to place a conservation easement on private land in the Santee Delta. Prevost followed Duff Holbrook as president and manager of White Oak Forestry, and he told two stories about experiences with Holbrook out in the Delta at Six Mile Island. He reflected on the Delta from hundreds of years ago, the changes created by the development of rice culture, and by the Santee Cooper project that reduced the Santee River flow by 90 percent. Prevost recalled some notable people from the Delta, including William Garrett and Ben Willy Richardson. Of threats to the Delta he identified changing climate and sea level rise. Prevost discussed the high significance of the Santee Delta on a number of levels.
William Garrett grew up on Blake Plantation, part of the Santee Gun Club. His parents were George and Celia Garrett; his father was a trunk minder. During his youth Garrett helped his family grow rice. He had four sisters and four brothers. The family did not have electricity so he cut wood for heating and cooking, and pumped water. Garrett told a story about swimming with his brother Moses toward a log in the South Santee River that turned out to be a large alligator. When he was a young guide for the Gun Club the manager allowed his brother and him to go over to Murphy Island to hunt cattle. He started working for the Santee Gun Club at age 18 or 19 for a salary of $2.50 per week. His main responsibility was to take care of the Santee Gun Club members he was guiding, and get them back safely after the day’s hunt. These hunts took place in blinds on the mainland (the Cape) and on Murphy and Cedar Islands. He recalled a young overconfident guide on his first day stating he could find his way back. When the young guide and his member were long overdue, the manager sent Garrett to find them. Garrett recalled going with his uncle to Murphy Island to get turtle eggs during his childhood. He recalled cattle lined up along the beach at night to get away from the mosquitoes. Garrett said he got used to the mosquitoes. He mentioned the names of some of the Gun Club members, and recalled taking Peter Matthiessen, the son of one of the members, goose hunting on Murphy one evening. Garrett was very worried about potential changes when the Gun Club was transferred to the state of South Carolina. He remembered walking four miles from his home on Blake Plantation to court his wife in South Santee. They were married in 1946. Part of his work for the Gun Club and the state was to build trunks, water control structures, and place them in the dikes. Garrett related his experience in South Santee during Hurricane Hugo. He shared three stories of accidental shootings at the Gun Club. Garrett mentioned changes in fishing after the Santee River was dammed and some of his fishing experiences. He also commented on race relations in the area.
Kenny Williams was born December 20, 1942. He grew up in Georgetown, SC in a lower middle class family. He learned fishing, hunting, and wildlife ethics from his father and uncles. He received an undergraduate degree from Wofford College, and a masters degree in wildlife biology from Auburn. While at Auburn, he applied for employment at Kinloch Plantation, owned by the Dupont family, and began work there after graduation. He learned about plantation management from the manager, Richard Stanland, and replaced him as manager when Stanland retired. The work at Kinloch included farming, use of water control structures, and managing rice fields for migratory waterfowl. The labor, working with a few employess, was often hard and challenging. Kinloch had a clubhouse where the family entertained friends and guests during the winter season, and his related responsibilities were directing the daily duck hunts and other wildlife hunts. While manager he was married and had two sons who grew up there. Williams had a "great" cook, Irene Rivens, who worked and cooked for him. The Duponts decided to sell Kinloch, which was purchased by Ted Turner; Williams discussed this transition. The biting insects of the Santee Delta were seasonally a most difficult challenge, and he recounted dealing with the worst times. Williams imagined what the Santee Delta was like when it was a virgin gum and cypress forest, and the effort required to build the rice fields. He commented on changes for the Santee Delta’s black population. Speaking about the conservation of the Santee Delta, he discussed his work as a consultant in land management for wildlife, and a regional biologist for Ducks Unlimited. He recalled a summer job while still at Auburn as a biological technician in Cape Romain National Wildlife Refuge, and a close encounter with a cottonmouth on Bulls Island. Williams also reflected on changes in the Santee Delta as a result of the damming of the Santee River, and decreasing waterfowl populations. Williams discussed the significance of the Santee Delta.
Jane Wineglass was born in 1927, and grew up in the South Santee community at Collins Creek. She was the youngest of fifteen children, and a self-described tomboy. Her mother, Eve (maiden name Manigault) Green, was born on Murphy Island; her father was Sambo Green. Her mother worked as a cook at the Wedge Plantation, and walked to and from work. When her mother became disabled, Wineglass took over as cook and eventually worked for a new owner, Dr. Richard Dominick. He hosted an annual event in the South Santee community. Wineglass also played at the Wedge during her childhood: beside her mother working there she had a number of family members living there. The Dominicks had a home in London, and took Wineglass there for six weeks. She went along as cook, but for her it was a "glorious" vacation. After Dominick died and the Wedge was purchased by the University of South Carolina, she went to work for a while at the Santee Gun Club. Wineglass recalled her father and his work as a carpenter: repairing homes, building homes, building trunks for controlling water, and generally doing "neat" work. In dealing with mosquitoes, she would break off branches from a shrub to beat them off. Though Wineglass was raised in a large family, she had only one child, a son, who died from being "heartbroken". She still has grandchildren in NC who occasionally visit. Wineglass recalled her parents growing rice in a low spot on their property. Her father used a wagon to go to work, pulled by an oxen named Pete. The animal was given to the family by the government to use for plowing their garden. Since her childhood, Wineglass has attended the same church, Greater Mount Zion AME Church. She became one of their local ministers. She reflects on the tragedy at Mother Emmanuel AME Church in Charleston. She regularly attends Sunday school, Sunday service, an evening service at another church in Awendaw, and a Tuesday evening prayer meeting. Of her fourteen siblings, only one, William Green, is still alive. The most important aspect of the Santee Delta for Wineglass: it is home, and the best place for her to be.
Henrietta Smalls was born in Germantown SC on October 24, 1925 to Mary and Isaiah Robinson. She moved to Shulerville and Mauss Swamp before returning to Germantown. According to Smalls, life was rough: there was no electricity or running water, and there was little opportunity for employment. Her mother planted a garden and cooked on wood fires; the family also had cows, hogs, and chickens. Smalls helped out by gathering firewood, pumping water from a well, and washing clothes. Walking was a necessity without a car. She married Peter Smalls; he served in the Army in the Pacific in World War II, and afterward worked for many years at the Naval Shipyard. Before she married, Smalls worked at Hampton Plantation a couple days a week in the flower gardens. She had four children, and after they were all in school she went to work in Charleston at National Linen. Smalls’ godmother was Sue Alston, known as the Angel of Hampton Plantation. She spent much time with Alston at her home in Germantown, and described her as the mother of the community. Smalls went to her church – Howard AME – and attended prayer meetings at her home. She has continued to plant a garden, and greens are her favorite. Smalls talked about Hurricane Hugo, and the recent flooding. After the family got a car, Smalls helped out members of the Germantown community, taking people shopping, to the doctor, and on other business. She reflected on changes in her community.
Pat Ferris was born in Greenwood Lake, NY, and lived in Virginia and New York until age nine when he moved to South Carolina. His grandmother had a modern house on South Island with electricity supplied by a generator. The family also had the old plantation house on Cat Island. His grandfather was William G. Ramsey, who worked for the DuPont Company. He became a senior engineer at DuPont, and his stock holdings became very valuable for the family. He came to South Carolina because of the Dupont’s interest in turpentine, and became aware of the excellent hunting opportunities. Living on Cat Island and South Island in his youth, Ferris felt it was “heaven”. He had a little dinghy he rowed around on Winyah Bay, and hunted ducks with a shotgun given to him at age 10 by his grandmother. She also gave him the job of killing snakes and alligators: the latter damaged the dikes. He received a nickel for each kill. Ferris learned to sail on a summer vacation to Nantucket Island. He and his brother would go along with a harbor pilot who guided ships into Georgetown. They signed on as cabin boys on a round trip from Brooklyn, NY, to Georgetown, SC, on the lumber schooner Annie C. Ross. Ferris also described a voyage with his brother and a friend in their teenage years in a catboat from Greenport, Long Island to South Carolina. Ferris went to boarding school, and would spend summers on South Island. Ferris attended the University of North Carolina (UNC) when WWII broke out, and he entered the Coast Guard. He patrolled first St. Helena Sound, and then off Charleston in private yachts. He helped a one-armed man pull a seine net on the edge of Winyah Bay. He knew Tom Yawkey, owner of the Boston Red Sox, and owner of the majority of Cat, South, and North Islands. He went on hunts with him on those properties and elsewhere. Cat Island Plantation continued to actively cultivate rice until 1941. With the damming of the Santee River by Santee Cooper, the influx of saltwater did considerable damage to the dikes, and the family received a $6000 settlement. Ferris described years of hunting on Cat island: deer, ducks, and turkeys. He described how Tom Yawkey set up the Yawkey Wildlife Center. Ferris returned to recounting his Coast Guard service, describing his transfer to the South Pacific after going through training at the Loran School. He was at Guam when the war ended, and returned to the US on the aircraft carrier Belleau Wood. He finished by telling a story when he and his brother were “bad boys’ during their childhood on Cat Island.
When Pierre Manigault was a child, his grandfather Edward owned Rochelle Plantation. When his father Peter took over Rochelle’s management in Pierre’s high school years, Manigault was put to work cultivating a ten-acre rice field, giving him insight into the difficulties of this job. He recalled Herman “Duff” Holbrook, who went to work for his father as president of White Oak Forestry and manager of Rochelle. Holbrook was like another grandfather for Manigault, and a mentor with a vast fund of knowledge about wildlife and the Santee Delta. He worked with Holbrook for a number of summers and spring breaks. Manigault’s great-grandfather, Arthur, after discontinuing rice cultivation, purchased controlling interest in Charleston’s newspaper. His father Peter, when manager of the newspaper, invested in pine lands in the Delta for the raw materials necessary for newspaper, and set up White Oak Forestry, a subsidiary of Evening Post Industries. Conservation for wildlife habitat was a priority, and Peter Manigault’s conservation efforts including his leadership in establishing the first conservation easement in the Santee Delta by a private landowner. Manigault discussed the impact of the October 2015 floods on the Delta. He talked about his father’s good friend, Ted Turner, who purchased Kinloch Plantation next to Rochelle. They shared interests in media and yacht racing. Manigault reflected on the early Huguenot Manigaults who immigrated to America and the Santee Delta; he also imagined the transformation of the Delta from forest to rice fields. He considered the labor required for that massive undertaking, and the incredible craftsmanship of enslaved workers seen in such buildings as St. James Santee Church, and various Delta plantation houses. He described the significance of the Santee Delta as an internationally recognized conservation area. Manigault has followed in his father’s footsteps in working to conserve the Delta.
